I am curious about "foaming" my softwash mixes by injecting compressed air into the outlet stream. I have a device that will accomplish this but my question is, since all softwashing systems chemicals are phosphate free, will my mix still foam? As I understand it, phosphates is what gives soaps and chems the "foaming" characteristic.
Brandon Vaughn said
Nov 12, 2015
Ryan, phosphates added definitely give chemicals a lot more stick and bubbles. I've seen those foamer devices, and although I've never used one for SoftWashing (I don't carry an air compressor on my truck), I would assume that they would still give some foaming action to phosphate-free chemicals, but not as much as if phosphates were present.
But if you test it out, let us know what you find!
Tim Teed said
Nov 12, 2015
I don't worry about the products or processes too much. I think that based on the volume and experience of AC, that if there was a better way to apply or a way that created more benefit to homeowner or contractor then AC would would have developed a product or process. I do know that you don't want to have too much cling because it will cling too much to plants. We actually use very little SH.
Chad Eneix said
Nov 12, 2015
I have never felt any foaming was needed, at least not enough to add another contraption to my rig. All I've ever needed was a little extra Green Wash or Terra Wash for cling, or to simply spray/ dwell/ spray again. In addition, one of the advantages of the SWS solutions is that areas that are infested tend to foam a little as they start to work. This is an advantage because you, your employees, and customers can see the stuff working.
I also think that a ton of suds running out of the gutters, sitting on the ground, and all over the plants would be perceived as less "green."
Brandon Vaughn said
Nov 12, 2015
+1 on Chad and Tim's input. Spot on!
Jeffrey Kirby said
Nov 12, 2015
Adding a foaming agent--a type of surfactant--will aid in the applied cleaning solution clinging to the substrate better, i.e. more product adhering for a longer dwell time. However, this will also add to the necessary rinse time and amount of water. There is a balance.
Occassionally, I use a surfactant additive in my cleaning solution. Mostly on roof washing, when I am not rinsing. This helps to offset poor technique in roof spraying--using too much product as a result of inexperience.
I do not recommend adding additional foaming agents, or surfactants, to your cleaning solution. You can accomplish more in a more efficient manner by improving your technique & procedure, using less product to achieve more, than you can by taking the quick result method of adding surfactants. This is the school of thought of the power washing company trying to match process with a well-practiced softwashing company. down streaming uses much more water in the cleaning solution, therefore, the need for additional cling (dwell) time, i.e. the need for a foaming agent, in order to achieve the result of a more appropriate cleaning solution mix.
Troy Layman said
Nov 23, 2015
Before I discovered soft washing I had a "Fohmer" device that was designed to use high pressure air to create an aspirated mix...lots of foam and bubbles. It stuck well and did not require a lot of bleach to get a good clean, but a surface you can spray in a few minutes can take 10X the amount of time to rinse, wasting a lot of water and time. Although many surfactants (sodium laural sulfate, sodium lauryth sulfate, ammoniam laural sulfate, ammoniam lauryth sulfate and other sulfates and phosphates) are health safe, as many are used in soaps, shampoos, toothpastes and other healthcare products that foam, a lot of them are not safe to use with bleach.
AC Lockyer said
Nov 24, 2015
I in my experience have a personal preference of non-foaming chems while softwashing. Reason being is,
1. It is vert hard to see if your chemicals are working beneath a foam.
2. As Troy mentioned above foam and the use of thicker chems require much, much more rinsing time.
3. I believe that teaching better technique solves all of the issues that might be addressed with foaming.
4. I believe personally that foam really doesnt help in the cleaning it is just making the contractor feel better. (i.e. the fishing lures are more made for fishermen than for the fish they catch.)
Really hope this helps!
AC
Bob Riddick said
Nov 24, 2015
Ryan, I find your question to be quite reasonable, and I think the responses are truly professional and well put. So well put I find I have nothing to add, and THAT says a lot!
A very good read. Thanks all.
Ryan Harper said
Jun 1, 2016
Thanks everyone for the input! Ill definately take it all in!!
I am curious about "foaming" my softwash mixes by injecting compressed air into the outlet stream. I have a device that will accomplish this but my question is, since all softwashing systems chemicals are phosphate free, will my mix still foam? As I understand it, phosphates is what gives soaps and chems the "foaming" characteristic.
Ryan, phosphates added definitely give chemicals a lot more stick and bubbles. I've seen those foamer devices, and although I've never used one for SoftWashing (I don't carry an air compressor on my truck), I would assume that they would still give some foaming action to phosphate-free chemicals, but not as much as if phosphates were present.
But if you test it out, let us know what you find!
I also think that a ton of suds running out of the gutters, sitting on the ground, and all over the plants would be perceived as less "green."
+1 on Chad and Tim's input. Spot on!
Adding a foaming agent--a type of surfactant--will aid in the applied cleaning solution clinging to the substrate better, i.e. more product adhering for a longer dwell time. However, this will also add to the necessary rinse time and amount of water. There is a balance.
Occassionally, I use a surfactant additive in my cleaning solution. Mostly on roof washing, when I am not rinsing. This helps to offset poor technique in roof spraying--using too much product as a result of inexperience.
I do not recommend adding additional foaming agents, or surfactants, to your cleaning solution. You can accomplish more in a more efficient manner by improving your technique & procedure, using less product to achieve more, than you can by taking the quick result method of adding surfactants. This is the school of thought of the power washing company trying to match process with a well-practiced softwashing company. down streaming uses much more water in the cleaning solution, therefore, the need for additional cling (dwell) time, i.e. the need for a foaming agent, in order to achieve the result of a more appropriate cleaning solution mix.
1. It is vert hard to see if your chemicals are working beneath a foam.
2. As Troy mentioned above foam and the use of thicker chems require much, much more rinsing time.
3. I believe that teaching better technique solves all of the issues that might be addressed with foaming.
4. I believe personally that foam really doesnt help in the cleaning it is just making the contractor feel better. (i.e. the fishing lures are more made for fishermen than for the fish they catch.)
Really hope this helps!
AC
Ryan, I find your question to be quite reasonable, and I think the responses are truly professional and well put. So well put I find I have nothing to add, and THAT says a lot!
A very good read. Thanks all.